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Post by apothecarybob on Apr 13, 2014 14:07:46 GMT -5
I got my hands on the new Imperial Gua....errr...Astra Militarum book. I gotta say that this is what the IG should have been from the start. I'm not going to go over all of the new rules right now, but if anybody has fought against guard previously, the core rules have stayed the same. This is my first take at a list using the new rules and I think it is pretty good.
Commissar Yarrick 145pts company command squad, medipack, heavy flamer, 2 flamers, astropath, master of fleet, master of ordanance, vets have carapace, krak grenades, commander has carapace, meltabombs, power weapon, kurov's aquila 257pts commissar, power weapon 40pts primaris psyker, level 2, 75pts ministorum priest 25pts ministorum priest 25pts infantry platoon 450pts platoon command squad, medipack, 3 meltaguns 75pts infantry squad, meltagun, power weapon 75pts infantry squad, meltagun, power weapon 75pts infantry squad, meltagun, power weapon 75pts infantry squad, meltagun, power weapon 75pts infantry squad, meltagun, power weapon 75pts veteran squad, 3 meltaguns, power weapon, forward sentries, demolitions 145pts veteran squad, 3 meltaguns, power weapon, forward sentries, demolitions 145pts manticore, camo-netting, hull heavy flamer 185pts manticore, camo-netting, hull heavy flamer 185pts hydra, hull heavy flamer, 70pts wyrdvane psykers 60pts 4 ratlings 40pts aegis defense line 50pts
allies inquisitor coteaz 100pts
Imperial guard now have access to divination, and so cheap too!. I can get a level 1 primaris psyker with divination for 50pts! This list has so many rerolls going on it isnt even funny. Yarrick has the ability to issue orders, though he can't be a warlord unless there is no company command squad. Orders got amazing. You still have the standard ones from before, plus a bunch of cool ones like giving the unit precision shot, or pinning, or ignore cover for just a few. Kurov's aquila gives preferred enemy to all Astra Militarum units within 6 inches of the bearer, so imagine all the rerolls, especially when used next to the manticores or a blob of 50 guys
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Post by dante on Apr 14, 2014 14:17:32 GMT -5
From what I have been reading the hydra is trash and the ratlings don't really have any purpose other than you had 40 points it looks like. Other than that I don't really know whats different...needs more vendettas!
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Post by apothecarybob on Apr 14, 2014 19:28:37 GMT -5
You're right about the ratlings, i could drop for an enginseer for the same points. The hydra lost a lot of its versatility with this new addition, but AA at 70pts still isn't something to shake a stick at imo
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Sam
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Post by Sam on Apr 18, 2014 9:59:02 GMT -5
If you already have an aegis why do you want to pay 70 points for a hydra when you can pay 50 pts for a quad gun with interceptor and skyfire?
Ya the new book is great. Just a ton of options and combinations without any truly ridiculous units. It is a bit light on anti air but it isnt much of a problemn with the weight of fire this army puts out. best options for antiair are hydra 70 points for a skyfire 2x twinlinked auto cannon HWS w autocannon 75 pts 3x autocannon vendetta 170pts for 3x twinlinked lascannons and quad gun 2x twinlinked skyfire interceptor autocannon.
Ratlings are not bad. They a cool cheap sniper unit. There really isnt as much need for precision snipers rifles with the new "take aim" order but they are a decent cost for what they do. Thier new rule allowing them to run after they fire is interesting even if it doesnt add much. I cant really see much of a use for it. So you deploy your squad of ratlings in ruins, fire at full BS, then run them out of line of sight, then next movement phase move them back into LOS, snapfire your heavy weapon sniper rifle, then run then back out of line of sight? Or start the game on top of ruins for better LOS, hope you roll a 3+ on your run so you can run your ratlings to the second level and protect them from barrage attacks?
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Sam
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Post by Sam on Apr 18, 2014 10:21:15 GMT -5
This is the 1850pt guard list i have once i put together the two wyverns i just got (everything is based and painted except the vendettas/artillery) CCS-carapace(CC only),Lascannon,Master of Ordinance=105 PCS-flamer x4,dedicated transport: Chimera=115 Infantry(combined)- Infantry1 grenade launcher/heavy bolter Infantry2 grenade launcher/heavy bolter Infantry3 grenade launcher/heavy bolter=65x3 HWS autocannon x3=75 SWS1 meltagun x2/demolition=70 SWS2 meltagun x2/demolition=70 veteran squad1-plasmagun x2/Heavy flamer, Dedicated transport: chimera=165
veteran squad2-plasmagun x2/Heavy flamer, Dedicated transport: chimera=165
Vendetta x2=340 Armoured sentinal x3,lascannon x3=150
Manticore=170 Wyvern x2=130
Aegis defense line/Quad gun=100
This is the 1850 list ill play when i order and paint another squad of Krieg, Vanquisher, and find a priest/tank commander model i like
Commander Pask/Leman Russ Punisher Leman Russ Vanquisher plus Lascannon Leman Russ Vanquisher plus Lascannon Priest (w conscripts) PCS Infantry 1 w autocannon(combined) Infantry 2 w autocannon(combined) Infantry 3 w autocannon(combined) 30 Conscripts SWS1 flamer x3 SWS2 flamer x3 vet squad1 meltagun x2 +Heavy flamer vet squad2 meltagun x2 +Heavy flamer
Vendetta x2 Manticore w camo-netting Wyvern x2 Aegis defense line w Quad gun
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Post by apothecarybob on Apr 27, 2014 21:23:28 GMT -5
Commissar Yarrick 145pts Pask 70pts Leman Russ Punisher, heavy bolter sponsons 160pts Leman Russh Punisher, heavy bolter sponsons 160pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Ministorum priest 25pts Ministorum priest 25pts Ministorum priest 25pts Infantry Platoon 475pts Platoon Command squad, medipack, 3 meltaguns 75pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts veterans, 3 meltaguns, demolitions, chimera with hull Heavy flamer 185pts veterans, 3 meltaguns, demolitions, chimera with hull Heavy flamer 185pts 5 Wyrdvane Pskers 60pts 5 Rough Riders 55pts
Inquisitor Coteaz 100pts Ordo Xenos inquisitor, rad grenades, psychotroke grenades, 3x servo skulls, power armor, force sword, level 1 102pts 1997pts
Another list I have. I had 3 scout sentinels originally, but after trial, they don't fit so well. More psykers=more chance to get the powers I want, where I want. The Rough Riders ride out of sight behind Pask and counter charge and enemy units that get too close
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Sam
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Post by Sam on Apr 29, 2014 8:10:59 GMT -5
Commissar Yarrick 145pts Pask 70pts Leman Russ Punisher, heavy bolter sponsons 160pts Leman Russh Punisher, heavy bolter sponsons 160pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Ministorum priest 25pts Ministorum priest 25pts Ministorum priest 25pts Infantry Platoon 475pts Platoon Command squad, medipack, 3 meltaguns 75pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts veterans, 3 meltaguns, demolitions, chimera with hull Heavy flamer 185pts veterans, 3 meltaguns, demolitions, chimera with hull Heavy flamer 185pts 5 Wyrdvane Pskers 60pts 5 Rough Riders 55pts Inquisitor Coteaz 100pts Ordo Xenos inquisitor, rad grenades, psychotroke grenades, 3x servo skulls, power armor, force sword, level 1 102pts 1997pts Another list I have. I had 3 scout sentinels originally, but after trial, they don't fit so well. More psykers=more chance to get the powers I want, where I want. The Rough Riders ride out of sight behind Pask and counter charge and enemy units that get too close I like it, however your infantry platoon is 500 not 475. 85x5=425+75 Also its kinda lacking anti air. Another sick combo is double CCS with 2 officer of the fleets, making it very hard for people to bring on reserves or flyers and easier to bring in your flyers/reserves. Also i have to see what they do to psychic powers in this new edition update happening next month.
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Post by apothecarybob on Apr 29, 2014 9:09:15 GMT -5
You're right, small error
Revised version:Commissar Yarrick 145pts Pask 70pts Leman Russ Punisher, heavy bolter sponsons, recovery gear, relic plating 168pts Leman Russh Punisher, heavy bolter sponsons, recovery gear, relic plating 168pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Ministorum priest 25pts Ministorum priest 25pts Ministorum priest 25pts Infantry Platoon 500pts Platoon Command squad, medipack, 3 meltaguns 75pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts veterans, 3 meltaguns, demolitions, chimera with hull Heavy flamer 185pts veterans, 3 meltaguns, demolitions, chimera with hull Heavy flamer 185pts Hydra, recovery gear 75pts
Inquisitor Coteaz 100pts Ordo Xenos inquisitor, rad grenades, psychotroke grenades, 3x servo skulls, power armor, force sword, level 1 102pts 1998pts Fixed the points and got some AA. Recovery gear helps me keep the vehicles moving
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Sam
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Post by Sam on Apr 29, 2014 9:22:12 GMT -5
You're right, small error Revised version:Commissar Yarrick 145pts Pask 70pts Leman Russ Punisher, heavy bolter sponsons, recovery gear, relic plating 168pts Leman Russh Punisher, heavy bolter sponsons, recovery gear, relic plating 168pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Primaris Psyker, level 2 75pts Ministorum priest 25pts Ministorum priest 25pts Ministorum priest 25pts Infantry Platoon 500pts Platoon Command squad, medipack, 3 meltaguns 75pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts Infantry squad, plasma gun, power axe, meltabomb 85pts veterans, 3 meltaguns, demolitions, chimera with hull Heavy flamer 185pts veterans, 3 meltaguns, demolitions, chimera with hull Heavy flamer 185pts Hydra, recovery gear 75pts Inquisitor Coteaz 100pts Ordo Xenos inquisitor, rad grenades, psychotroke grenades, 3x servo skulls, power armor, force sword, level 1 102pts 1998pts Fixed the points and got some AA. Recovery gear helps me keep the vehicles moving Seems like a fun and well rounded list. Check out this battle report. Its a good writeup of the new AM. www.3plusplus.net/2014/04/battle-report-astra-militarum-vs-tau-empire/
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Sam
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Post by Sam on Jun 2, 2014 16:51:01 GMT -5
One of the rule changes for 7th that makes a bit more sense even if it's kinda a nerf is that leadership tests such as priests and officers of the fleet no longer use the highest leadership in the group but thier own leadership value unless the test is based on the entire unit I. Which cars it would be the highest value. This makes hymns on priests and reserve roles on oof much harder to pass on ld7.
Also vehicles have ws1 unless they are immobilized then it's ws0
And barrage weapons and templates like Flamers hit multiple levels in terrain like ruins.
You also no longer need to move to take a jink save so bikes or skimmers that went second no longer lose thier save because they haven't over yet.
There were lots of small changes that makes sense and changes things up a bit
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Post by bob on Jun 3, 2014 12:44:15 GMT -5
"There were lots of small changes that makes sense and changes things up a bit" There were also lots of small changes that don't make sense and change things up a bit Nick, after this weekend, what are your thoughts on this?
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Sam
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Post by Sam on Jun 3, 2014 13:46:53 GMT -5
Honestly I like this edition except I think unbound is useless since the foc is so flexible now that the only reason to take unbound is completely broken army lists and no one is going to have fun playing against that.
Psychic phase needs tweaks a warp charge limit and at least allowing templates and blasts on invisibility power. I'd also like to see the malefic primaris power work more like endless swarm then a flat out conjuring a new unit for 1 wound.
I don't really care for the come the apocolypse ally restriction. 12in deployment is nothing really. I rather see a morale, fear or, pinning test if within 12 inches.
That's it really. People lament assault but it's not so bad if you get assault vehicles. I'd like to see how orks do this edition too.
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Post by apothecarybob on Jun 3, 2014 16:27:31 GMT -5
"There were lots of small changes that makes sense and changes things up a bit" There were also lots of small changes that don't make sense and change things up a bit Nick, after this weekend, what are your thoughts on this? After this weekend I need to rethink how I play with IG. Guard have always been a move once and unload hell onto your enemy type of army. Therefore, I need to scrap the psychic powers (save for 1 or 2 primaris psykers for some defense and mild offensive capabilites) and go back to the roots of a crapton of guardsmen and a handful of tanks. That being said I do like the new rules a lot more than 6th edition, though I've always tested the priest on his own LD, and imo it isn't as bad as it could be. Guard got a lot of nice buffs, but there are so many things that counter act some of the tougher things that guard were able to do.
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Post by bob on Jun 5, 2014 12:34:53 GMT -5
I keep thinking abotu the Blobs. If you can guarantee a 4++, or Invis, or something that makes them hard as nails to shoot off the table, they're great....
...but Blobs feel out of fashion when it became clear that Tau and then Wave Serpents could gun down 50 guys in a couple turns without breaking a sweat.
I'm really not feeling Blobs anymore.
As much as I disliked the Taurox Spam stuff we saw when that mini-dex was released, I think the firepower they dish out, the Objective Secured rule, and the MSU-style play may make something like that really viable.
Anxious to see what you come up with, though. Lots of opportunity to win without killing anything these days...OS changes everything!
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Sam
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Post by Sam on Jun 6, 2014 12:56:40 GMT -5
Guards are still a very strong codex in 7th. However i think your list depends highly on the mission for victory points purposes. Playing maelstrom type games needs a highly mobile unit (or troops) to secure objectives. And guards are not really ideal for that type of constant mobility. You cant beat the wyvern for the price and amount of wounds it makes you roll saves for and barrages are still great. I still like the manticore for its high strength multiblasts that can still take off a hull point off a vehicle or wound off a MC even if it no longer can explode them. The vendetta is kinda expensive now but still one of the most survivable reliable flyers, antiflyer, antitank units, and useful for taking on knights. Leman Russes and its varients are back, more survivable, cheaper, and tank orders and/or pask make them much better. Eradicators, Exterminators, punishers, Vanquishers, and even the demolisher/leman russ are solid choices for thier roles. Personally I love the pask punisher it destroys infantry, Forces massive amounts of saves on MC's and light to medium armoured vehciles, rerolls wounds and hits of 1 (with Preferred enemy), is almost garaunteed several rending shots at ap2. Only issue imho is the 24 inch range on the main gun. I want to try out the Pask punisher and 2 eradicators or exterminators in a tank squadron (with prefered enemy) surrounded by a blob of conscripts lead by priests or inquisitors or commissars for cover and protection. If the conscripts die to fire its not really a huge issue because that means they arent hitting your other units. If they ignore the conscripts and target the tanks you will have a 5+ cover from them. You can suprisingly make conscripts pretty durable as you said with zealot from priests, or LD10 stubborn from inquisitors/commissars and invisibility or shrouded or 4++ from psykers. Oh and Cortez is still awesome in IG blobs especially as a mastery 2 level psyker.
I'm not super fond of psykers but I realize i need some help to counteract psykers(maybe demons too) in 7th. Its kinda funny giving a heretic inquistor a psyocculum to a blob gunline (or concripts blob) giving them all BS10 vs any unit with psykers.
I still like chimera's over taurox's I just feel they are more durable transports and durable transports are huge because of the objective secured rule. They can drop off thier squad on one objective and claim another in theory. Taurox's pair well with Scions because they lack heavy weapons and i do expect some scion lists or detachments to be about. I see transports being huge this editions. Rhino rush, mech lists, wave serpent spam, necron barges, even drop pods will just be using objective secured to win games.
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